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With a corporate, it might be to help them manage a material ESG risk or opportunity whereas with sovereigns, given that we know that there's limited agency, it might be to instead learn more so as that we get a better, clearer idea of how we want to value that security. Vish Hindocha: Amazing. The complexity and also the variety. I find mfs like you really interesting youtube. They're very hard to compete against or displace. And again, when you talk to issuers about sustainability, well, some quick, easy things that you can see can get you to the right path. One thing that really resonated with me is that none of this is really very easy, and you really have to beneath the surface to really understand the nuances and the tradeoffs and the impacts as we seek to navigate through them, that there aren't unfortunately any easy ideas in this space.

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But it's a timely reminder, a really powerful reminder about that ESG is not just a risk. In today's episode, we are going to take a slightly different approach. Is this better than the alternative? Remember, you can subscribe to All Angles through Spotify, Apple Podcasts or wherever you choose to get your podcast from. I think I must have said this in multiple episodes that I think best practice in the whole field of sustainable investing is yet to fully emerge. I find mfs like you really interesting times. For today's episode, I invited a member of my team, George Beesley, to come on with me to discuss what we think we've learned so far and where we might go in the future. Dave Falco: Hello Ross.

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But more than anything, I think Pilar's message on grit and how you deal with the dynamism that is being thrown at investors up and down the value chain today was really, really powerful. So it's not kind of one thing, and there's certainly no one size fits all. Nicole Zatlyn: I think we're absolutely seeing it, and it comes back to this point on value proposition, right? And it requires the participation of everyone on the team working collaboratively and working with a lot of different groups globally. But frankly, a lot of it has to do with my children and my husband, obviously. I find mfs like you really interesting and fun. 'saying wild this shit seafood market uk price what u fee! Nicole Zatlyn: Sure, and maybe thinking about one the company that we've owned at MFS, working really closely with our analysts.

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David Falco: I would certainly say in the last 12 to 15 months, the past rate of inflation, it seems to have been relatively easy for many companies, even companies that you might not have associated with strong pricing power in the past. Why do you choose to do this when there's so many other things that you have done and could use today? Vish Hindocha: That's incredible. And only very recently became a way that governments around the world can start to control for some of those things. You act very quickly, and it's a very iterative cycle. And I feel, again, there are gestures that are unnecessary, but really kind. So I think that's really powerful. You are able to go into the detail and appreciate the context and the minutia. What struck home for me is how dynamic this is and how pricing power can change and how it's delivered to so many different parts of the business and how that business is actually managed through the cycle. All of us are beholden to other stakeholders, all of whom care about this issue one way or the other. Stream i find mfs like u really interesting bro by groovy bot | Listen online for free on. It stresses on me the need to be vigilant, the need to monitor what is going on with these businesses all the time and to stay ahead of the ability to maintain and manage the pricing power. So you can go way back, just that pure love of learning is kind of a common trait that most of us share. Please select the membership level of your choice. In my day to day work, whenever I come across an interesting piece of research or my curiosity gets sparked by something and I share it internally, without fail, Nicole will always come back with links to several other pieces and much deeper and richer thinking than I have.

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And then how you do that might evolve, rightly so because the markets are also changing. Yeah, I completely agree. I think having that general perspective, having the connectivity, being able to draw from different areas of knowledge brings a lot to the table. Mahesh Jayakumar: I want to reemphasize that the environmental pillar, the social pillar, the governance pillar, those pillars are the same across these different parts of fixed income, but the factors underlying each of those pillars might not be the same.

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But I think really looking back, and obviously hindsight is 2020, what was the most valuable learning experience was really sharing information was key. Keep that in essence, in life and in work. I mean, I think we're all on a journey, right? I don't know if you or any of our listeners feel differently. But having said that, actually one of the kindest things was during COVID actually, unfortunately my husband had to have surgery, which was a really difficult period in time. I had a mother in one of my kids' class, would deliver food to me that she had cooked for us, because she knew that obviously I was going to be extremely busy. That keeps me going. And so the one company I'm thinking about here is a global leader in the area of electrification, and really focus on energy efficiency and automation. And we could have a whole separate conversation on those.

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And, you know, we, this is our global investment manager. You know, I think we've seen a lot of companies go from, you know, this isn't something we have to worry about to now setting net zero and science-based targets. And again, we would welcome any of your input or thoughts as we look ahead to season two. So I was really focused on the legal field, I thought I'd go into law. So, that's all absolutely important. So, from that perspective, in terms of brands and that, how do you think about pricing power on those businesses? Being able to be at the hub of information sharing from clients, different types of clients, different types of investors, but also being able to access what the syndicate desks are saying, what the investment bankers are saying, what the equity team is saying, when I look back, it was really understanding the importance of being able to be connected as much as possible to as much information as possible as well.

The dog started getting training and suddenly the training stopped because the person couldn't come anymore. I'm going to use those as a segue to talk about sustainability. Is that much harder than just using a backward-looking screened approach? No forecast can be guaranteed. So we've talked about some of the big picture and some of the thematic issues in environmental and social space. Nicole, before I ask you some more questions, a little bit more about you, like are there themes in this whole space that you're watching very intently, that you are looking to kind of play out or you know, excited to see how they may play out over time?